How online learning supports SQPs and RAMAs episode 4: companion animal and equine courses

RCVS Knowledge:
Welcome to this four-part series for Suitably Qualified Persons also known as Registered Animal Medicines Advisors. This series is a collaboration between RCVS Knowledge and AMTRA.

This podcast series will highlight how the courses on the RCVS Knowledge Learn platform can be used for your self-reflection CPD.  To access any of the courses mentioned, head to learn.rcvsknowledge.org and set up your free account.

This week’s episode covers VetTeamAMR, and the Companion Animal and Equine courses, an RCVS Knowledge initiative that promotes good antimicrobial stewardship in companion animal and equine practices.

Pam Mosedale:
Hi everyone. Today I’m talking to Freya Small. Freya is an SQP/RAMA. She’s a CA SQP, so companion animal and avian. And she works in veterinary practice as a dispensary manager,
which is a great role for an SQP. Hi Freya.

Freya Small:
Hello, good afternoon.

Pam Mosedale:
Thank you. So Freya and I are going to talk about the RCVS knowledge resources and how these can benefit SQPs in their CPD, particularly of the ones around antimicrobial resistance,
Vet Team AMR aimed at companion animal and equine vets, nurses, SQPs, everyone in the team.

So Freya, obviously it’s a really important role being a dispensary manager and as I say I think it’s a great role for an SQP and a veterinary practice but obviously in your role there or even in a role anywhere else in a saddlers or a pet shop you won’t be able to prescribe antibiotics and a lot of this information around antimicrobial resistance is about prescribing antibiotics but having looked at our resources do you think these resources are still useful for SQP/RAMAs?

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think it gives us lot of information, a lot of food for thought in how we proceed as RAMAs & SQPs and how we go about looking at the future of anthropobics and things like
that and kind of foreshadowing if there is going to be resistance, if we take steps now, how we can avoid kind of getting to the same point that they have had with anthelmintic resistance.

Pam Mosedale:
Absolutely, it’s a one health thing really isn’t it? It’s about human health as well and yes there’s lots of parallels as you say with the situation with anti-almentics.

Do you think these will be suitable for other people in the team in veterinary practice?

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think it provides a sort of generalized knowledge on it. It’s very informative. It’s not too scientific, so it’s not kind of just vets direct in that sense. I think it’d be very kind of
important to show the resources to anyone that would benefit, if that is in that animal setting. So if that is someone on front desk in a reception, kind of any office staff that have client interactions and equally any of those within store in pet shops, for example, that are having that initial conversation prior to leading them towards the SQP.

Pam Mosedale:
Absolutely, yeah I think you’re right, it’s really good thing for the whole team isn’t it? And another aspect that we sometimes forget about really that infection control, sorry antimicrobial resistance isn’t just about antibiotics, it’s about other things that prevent infections like infection control and that I think is very relevant isn’t it?

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think it’s one of the ways we can sort of, it’s the first step in safeguarding other patients, other animals in kind of avoiding any strains that they may be resistant to. And it
just kind of stops that first kind of interaction even introducing those bacteria that could cause the further problems.

Pam Mosedale:
And that’s very relevant to SQPs in any setting to make sure that the infection control is a priority for yourselves and for your customers. So, as we said, this is a good thing for the
whole team, so I’m sure the nursing team and the practice and some of them, maybe SQPs too, will be interested in the infection control part of this.

Freya Small:
Definitely, it’s relevant I think at any step that we go through with our interactions, be that kind of front of house or out the back, limiting that exposure risk that we have. So it will just
allow us to deal with any problems a lot more effectively when we know we’ve kind of taken out all the eliminating factors that we can do beforehand.

Pam Mosedale:
And you touched on before the parallels between this antimicrobial resistance and anti-almintic resistance. I think that’s a really important thing. And there’s a section in the
resources around communication and behaviour change, isn’t it? And I think that’s something that can be quite challenging to SQPs trying to get customers to think about those things
with choosing products.

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think client education, a lot of the time now, I’m finding personally myself, and I think my colleagues are as well, that clients are a lot more receptive to education regarding treatment prescribing and dynamically risk assessing what we need to give and when we need to give it, rather than going for the old hat version of we’ll just treat it and hopefully that’ll knock it on the head type attitude towards it.

Definitely taking it from this angle has helped a lot with clients. They are a lot more receptive than they probably were previously.

Pam Mosedale:
And we need to think about sustainability too, don’t we? Because obviously this just sending out wormers and flea controls all the time is not necessarily the right thing from a
sustainability point of view either.

Freya Small:
No, and I say, know with certain sort of topical products, is the studies they’ve done around environmental impacts as well. So definitely if we can kind of reduce down, but still treat
effectively for any of these problems that these animals may face, we’ll be better off kind of for ourselves and our environment in the long term, hopefully.

Pam Mosedale:
And for your equine colleagues, I’m sure they’re all very up to speed with all the technical aspects of resistance in horses. having that little bit of extra knowledge around behaviour
change when they have customers come in saying, I just want the stuff I used last year to wear my horse, could be, I think, probably useful.

Freya Small:
Definitely. I think it’s great that they have a canter system in place and that they can use that as a guide to kind of work through with their clients. I know it’s something I’ve spoken with a few on a companion animal side and it’d be nice for us to kind of develop that similar sort of risk assessment that we do and look at those kind of factors and treat more effectively like
they are doing with that quine and obviously it’s worked very well.

So hopefully with the response that they’ve had with canter, we can kind of implement the same on companion animal as well.

Pam Mosedale:
Absolutely and you’ve hit the nail on the head there with risk assessing. That’s what it’s all about isn’t it? It’s a risk assessing for individual animals what the right thing to do is and that’s the case with antimicrobials where vets are prescribing them but it’s also the case for all the other VPS medicines when SQPs are prescribing and supplying them.

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think it’s such a good umbrella to work under. And if we approach all these medicines in the same way that we are treating on a risk-based assessment, we can hopefully reduce that resistance we’re finding in any of the antimicrobial resistance that we may get now. And that we’re safeguarding for our future selves, for our pets and patients going forward.

Pam Mosedale:
Absolutely and in your particular role and the role of other SQPs who work in veterinary practice which there are a lot of SQP Ramazil do work in veterinary practice some are veterinary nurses some work in dispensary like yourself from different roles I think it could be useful to know about the different categories of antibiotics even though you’re not actually prescribing them.

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think to have that awareness, allows you to, again, it’s managing client expectations, I think. And a lot of the time that is kind of your main wall that you would have to overcome is if you have an open mind of communication, you’re confident in your knowledge and you’re relaying that effectively as well, it will make sort of their experience as well as owners a lot easier and a lot more kind of justifiable when we’re talking to them about treatment plans and where we want them to sort of proceed going forward.

Pam Mosedale:
And some of your colleagues who may be in the reception team who may be SQPs, certainly I’ve met receptionists who are SQPs, they may have to deal with the general public who are
not happy because they haven’t been given antibiotics, so there could be some useful background knowledge for them.

Freya Small:
I think kind of giving, say being forearmed is being forewarned and having that knowledge.

And it will, lot of the time, I found with clients when they do sort of come across that way at the front desk, it’s mainly because there’s a lack of understanding or a lack of knowledge and just that re sort of affirming of, know, this is okay. This is how we’re going to proceed. You know, we’re doing this, this, this, and this. And that’s why the vet has done this or, know,
your SQP has prescribed this kind of treatment. A lot of the time does kind of settle the clients and they respond a lot better.

Pam Mosedale:
As you say, it’s having that background knowledge, isn’t it? And I said at the beginning that you’re a companion animal, an avian, SQP, and these resources have technical parts to look
at for companion animals for equine and actually for poultry as well.

Freya Small:
Yes, yes, it’s one of those things, they kind of slip under the radar a bit with our chicken owners, but actually, you know, they’re some of the most proactive owners I think I’ve actually spoken to. So they’re very up for kind of trying new methods and what else they can kind of do to better their chickens’ lifestyle.

Pam Mosedale:
That’s right. it’s quite popular. I’ve had hens myself and it’s quite popular, isn’t it? Keeping hens now. And they can be in that sort of area where they’re not really small animals and
they’re not really farm animals. So great that we have SQPs with the knowledge to help them with products for that.

Another thing about being specifically in veterinary practice is that have you seen that we can actually do antibiotic guardians through these resources? We can become antibiotic guardians.

Freya Small:
Yes, yeah, yeah, I have. I say it was one thing until I was sort of introduced to it, I wasn’t aware of and actually reading into the guardians that you can have and the different levels that you can have them at as well. I think it’s a great tool to support a practice. It means we’re all singing from the same hymn sheet and that we are all working in one direction as well to
positively reinforce everything we’re trying to tell our clients.

Pam Mosedale:
Lovely, so you think maybe someone in your practice might do the antibiotic guardians then?

Freya Small:
I hope so, after this I’m definitely going back to petition it out to at least a few members of staff.

Pam Mosedale:
That’s brilliant. Now this CPD is not, I mean some of the more traditional if you like, AMTRA CPD, you get a set number of points. You know what you’re going to get when you do the
webinar or read the article. But for this, the points you get are based on reflecting on what you’ve looked at.

So I wonder if you could, and that’s always a bit worrying for people who’ve not done that before, so I wonder if you could help your colleagues a little bit on how you would reflect on what you’ve looked at.

Freya Small:
In the points that I’ve learned from the podcast in this sense. So, you know, what was the discussion point? What was my takeaway? What were my opinions regarding that? And
actually then, you know, my implementation thereafter, am I going to now work on having another guardian within the vet practice if that’s what, if I’m based there, or if I’m in a retail
setting, if, you know, we’re going to look at using more of the resources online that we have here to educate the whole team.

So kind of identifying what we’ve spoken about, what I have learned, sorry, and then what my implementation is thereafter.

Pam Mosedale:
Yeah, and it doesn’t have to be a complicated essay, does it? A few bullet points are quite adequate for reflection, I think.

Freya Small:
Definitely, think as long as it’s concise and it’s to the point and you know in yourself when you’re reading back on it what you clearly can understand and what your points are going
forward. It definitely doesn’t need to be like a four page essay regarding kind of all the other bits and bobs around it and what’s going on and that around the topic.

Pam Mosedale:
It’s about being able to look back yourself, isn’t it? Maybe in a year’s time and think, I did that, I did that webinar, can I remember what they said? And you might be able to look back,
at least look at your bullet points and maybe direct you back.

And of course you can dip into these as often as you want to as well. I think another good thing with reflection is sometimes
saying what you might change as a result. Is that something you’ve thought of when you’ve reflected on these things?

Freya Small:
Definitely, I think it gives you an aspect that you maybe haven’t thought of before. A point of view that actually, know, that actually, that doesn’t make quite good sense. You know, I can
see what that person’s saying, where they’re coming from, and I see a gap within what we’re doing to implement that change within our setting. I say definitely, it’s such a useful thing to
have and making those decisions to where you take your next step. I think it is a very useful thing to kind of look forward to doing.

Pam Mosedale:
And some of the, as I said, of the CPD, which is very good, is very traditional. It’s all about life cycles and things like that. So how do you think this CPD kind of compares?

Freya Small:
I think it’s a different aspect to the world that we’re all in, that we’re all involved in. Even if it doesn’t directly affect people, at this point, I think we’re kind of in that stage with our medication, VWPS and POM-V, that it’s becoming more of a topic of discussion. And again, to be forewarned regarding anything like that, you’re going to be able to put your best foot
forward and make any decisions that you can make in order to better facilitate your client care.

Pam Mosedale:
And the whole of the course, the other parts as well, it’s all about responsible use of medicines and that’s the key, isn’t it? Being responsible when we use medicines. All of us are
involved.

Freya Small:
Yes, was going say, yeah, from the person on the phone kind of taking the initial inquiry right through to the SQP or even through to the vet. It’s important that we are all kind of working
from that same hymn sheet and trying to make things better for our patients.

Pam Mosedale:
Absolutely. In essence, would you actually recommend this CPD to some of your fellow SQP/RAMAs then?

Freya Small:
Definitely. We have one of our nurses today I was speaking to that’s a few points shy of where she needs to be. And I said, well, actually, you know, have you looked at this tool online? Have you looked at RCVS Knowledge that you can go and read and listen to? And it’s very good in the way that it’s multi-presented. So you have the audio tracks, you have the visual presentations. I think there is definitely something there that caters to kind of everyone’s learning style as well, which is good to see.

Pam Mosedale:
Yeah, because we all have different learning styles, don’t we? We all like different things. And some of it’s quite bite-sized too, isn’t it?

Freya Small:
Definitely, and the way that it’s structured as well allows you to kind of work through each bit. So if you’ve only got sort of half an hour and you can kind of achieve one of the presentations or the podcast, then it’s good to listen to that while you can do and then work back into it at a later point. And you know where it is because it’s tracked you from how much you’ve completed previously.

Pam Mosedale:
Good and you could even listen to them in the car on the way to work, you? It’s a good use of your commuting time. Okay lovely, well it’s been so nice to talk to you Freya and I hope that some of your colleagues will have a look at these resources as well because the other thing is they are completely free and hopefully did you find them quite easy to access?

Freya Small:
Yes, very easy to access and very easy to set up an account for. They say it’s very user friendly, so couldn’t recommend it enough from personal point of view as well.

Pam Mosedale:
Thank you.

Freya Small:
Thank you very much.

RCVS Knowledge:
Thank you for listening to this podcast from RCVS Knowledge and AMTRA.

If you want to learn more about the topics discussed, head to learn.rcvsknowledge.org to start your learning.

Our transcripts and closed captions are generated manually and automatically. Every effort has been made to transcribe accurately. The accuracy depends on the audio quality, topic, and speaker. If you require assistance, or something doesn’t seem quite right, please contact ebvm@rcvsknowledge.org